Last time I did one of these, I was promising a Providence ballpark would be next. Many suns later, here we go:

Below, you will see, roughly, maybe, essentially, where the "Messer Street Grounds" was located, from 1878 to 1887. It was home to the NL's Providence Grays, two-time league champions before they disbanded in 1885.


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There are two detailed sites about the park, here (ProvidenceGrays.Org) and here (Project Ballpark), plus the Wiki page. You can learn more about the park and the team there, but my little project is all about pinpointing the park's footprint. Those sites helped me a lot. This was a tough one, though, as there was some conflicting info.

The first site said the land owned by Josiah Chapman, whose farm the park was built on, was bordered by Messer Street on the east, Willow on the north, and unknown on the west and south. I went to 1875 maps of Providence Ward 8 and 9 on this awesome site and actually saw Chapin's land notated. It even showed the location of Stephen Tourtellot's house (the yellow house on my map above), one of the only houses built on the land (which is why they were able to put a baseball field on it). That house still stands--check out the street view of it. The house shown at the Project Ballpark site above is right below the corner of Messer and Willow, and also shows a plaque which says the park in "near" there. So even though the 1875 map showed me that Chapin's land extended many more blocks south, I guess we have to assume that the northeast corner of it (by Messer and Willow) is where the ballyard sat.

As for how it was situated: I read where there was an east and west bleachers, which would imply the park faced north or south. But I also read that the area beyond center and right field was used for circuses, and that implies the park would face southeast, leaving the area to the south of the field as circusville. (Because Chapin's land ran from Willow down several blocks south.) I liked that idea, but I went with south-facing for my map. Either way you can match it to another fact, which is that the Tourtellot house was just beyond the left field fence, and would have people sitting on its roof watching games.

The Project Ballpark site also gave dimensions--I don't know how they could have known this--and I made my footprint accordingly to fit in onto the land, leaving room for the grandstand just below Willow. It's almost as if they had right field go all the way out to a far away point, and had the fence cut straight across until it got to left, where it had to go around that one house. Which would make sense if they were respecting the boundary of houseless Wood Street. (See the pink section of this old map to see the Chapin land--Messer Street runs along the bottom; north is to the right. That shows the top border--the bottom border extends way down past where this map ends, as you can see if you search the other ward 8/9 maps. I also read that his land was renamed the "West Training Ground Plat"--on some old maps you see the area to the east of Chapin's land referred to as "Training Ground Plat.")

I'm also wondering what the building is in the background of the shot on the Project Ballpark page of the team on the field is. I don't think it's around anymore, but it does prove there were buildings just behind the grandstand, which fits my theory--that would be the north side of Messer Street.

Hope you got all that. One more thing--Babe Ruth played for the Providence Grays, but that was obviously much later, and it was a different Grays, playing in a different park. The minor league Grays lasted a good long time, yet I can't figure out where Ruth played ball when he was here. Can't find the location or the name. That's for you to research, I guess.

Labels: old ballpark locations

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The Detroit Wolverines played in the NL from 1881 to 1888, when they disbanded, having won one league title in their time. Their park was about a mile north of where the Tigers play today. "Recreation Park" was the public park where the ballpark stood, but as far as I know, there was no specific name for it other than that.

I learned that from the plaque shown on this site. But finding where that plaque was turned out to be difficult, thanks to conflicting info on that page. I finally found the spot, though. See the marker on the map. The picture is looking northwest. I looked at it for way too long--found the brick walkway, compared tree locations, building tops, etc.

Anyway, that plaque claims to be in "the left field" so I made my footprint fit that. I think the park could've been further south, but it should be exactly right east-west-wise, as the Wikipedia page says it was bordered on the east by Beaubien Street, which you can see a little south of where the park is/was.

Labels: old ballpark locations

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Also known as State Street Grounds, this is where the Chicago Cubs (then called the White Stockings) played in their first two years in the NL, 1876 and 1877. Wikipedia gives a great description (from Green Cathedrals) of where the park was and how it was laid out. They say it had to look like a home plate, but for all we know, it could have been rounded off in left and right field. But I drew it as home plate-shaped, only having to guess just how far north or south home plate was positioned within the block, leaving room for any kind of grandstand above it.

This page shows a picture of the buildings that stand there today. (I grabbed you a nice street view of that spot.

And here's a crazy-long article about the sad state of the residences that stand all along that section of State Street today.

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The Louisville Grays were a charter member of the National League, and played at the Louisville Baseball Park in 1876 and 1877, their only two years in existence. The team was involved in baseball's first gambling scandal. Their ballpark burned down a few years later, and the site became a posh neighborhood called St. James Court. They have an annual art show there, and this page tells about the history of the neighborhood, though it doesn't mention the ballpark.

I don't know how it was situated. But my guess is based on the fact that this page shows a picture of the building at the northwest corner of 3rd and Hill--so I figure it's on that block as opposed to the west side of St. James Court, or further north along that road. I put right field in that spot as opposed to home plate, as that would make for a tough sun. There is a plaque visible on Steet Views at the north end of St. James--I'd love to see what that says. Maybe home plate was actually up there. I thought maybe the park was in what they call "Central Park," but I have read that that park was already there, and the land south of it was all park-land, too, so the ballpark was in that southern section.

Next up: either Providence or something else. Maybe even another Louisville park.

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Before I get to the Providence parks, which will take more research, I'll do an easy one. League Park in Cleveland. As you can see, the field is still a big green lawn. Here's the street view from out by the ticket office. The street views are newer than the aerials, because if you look at those houses right past left field, one is a pile of rubble on the aerial, and it's cleared on the street view. The two houses next to the crumbled one are boarded up, and on the boards it says "5 VICE." It's also pretty sad how you can see on the overhead remnants of two softball infields on the lawn, and from other photos, you can tell there had been a basketball court in that rectangle by the ticket office. All gone.

Here's a good little page showing pics of the place from last summer.

The ticket office and part of a wall remain--but efforts are being made to build the place all over again.

(Clem's site has been very helpful doing all these parks. I also use aerial photos to help place the footprint.)

Labels: old ballpark locations

My mom and I will be at the library in West Hartford tomorrow night, Tuesday, Oct. 28th, at 7 PM, for a reading/signing. More info at the Dirty Water blog.

That brings me to the latest old ballpark. Hartford had a National League team in the league's first season, 1876. The Dark Blues moved the Brooklyn the following year before disbanding. Their park was the Hartford Ball Club Grounds, and it lived riiiiiight...here:


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This was another tough one to get the exact footprint of. The page I linked above mentions the church built by Samuel Colt's wife, which is still there. And it says how Hendricxsen Ave used to run right past there, and that the corner of it and Wyllys Ave was where the park was. It also mentioned a bird's eye view drawing which showed in-play trees. I had almost given up looking for an 1876-ish Hartford map, and then I found the exact one they were talking about. I see the trees, and the little diamond, right out in front of the church, with the old Hendricxsen Ave running along the third base line. Click the link, then click once on it to enlarge. Then go to the H in Hartford at the bottom. Go straight up to the twin sailboats, then go from there toward 11:00 for about two inches. There's the chucrh, and a field facing south (left is south on this map) with players on it.

So I put a "field" in there--I don't know what the distances to the fences were, or precisely where home was, so I just kind of made something up.

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Just down West Lehigh Avenue from Shibe Park was Baker Bowl, home of the Philadelphia Phillies from 1887 to 1938. It was demolished in 1950. There was a huge soap advertisement on the 60 foot sign on the right field fence that read "The Phillies use Lifebouy." Legend has it someone once broke into the park to add "and they still stink."

This was another easy one to make the footprint for, since it's right on a city block. I even included the 60 feet of foul territory all around the field. This is also another park Google Maps has given a nod to with its name on its old spot.

This current building can be seen in this artist's rendition of the park. It's the one with six windows across, out past center field across North Broad Street. You can also see the same row houses across the street from the third base side that are there today on the Google satellite view above. (Though the building on the corner--Lehigh and 15th--seems to be gone.)

Another obvious feature that's still there today are the railroad tracks. They went under center field, creating "the hump" in the outfield. As you can see, the tracks still run underneath that corner of the block.

Go to the corner of Huntingdon and Broad in Street Views to see the plaque. (Better pic at bottom of this page.)

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Shibe Park, Philadelphia, home of the A's, and later the Phillies. The planned move of home plate from here to The Vet via helicopter was canceled when fans started destroying the park during its final game in 1970.

There's now a gigantic church taking up the whole block.

Note: with these parks, there were usually dimension changes. Fences that were 500 or 600 feet away in the earlier days were moved in. I usually go with the final dimensions, or just a rough average, or something. Whatever. No biggie.

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Ebbets Field, Brooklyn, NY. Never realized it was so close to Prospect Park.

Compare this photo to current satellite map. At bottom right, those buildings are still there. Roofs (rooves?) are the same. And at top right, those three trees still live! One on one side of Sullivan Place, two on the other.

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Pittsburgh's Forbes Field was tough. The wall from left-center to right still stands, and then a brick line on the sidewalk shows where the wall was from the left field foul pole out to almost center field. I found the brick line (see Street View here), though the wall is obscured by trees. From there I measured the distances back to home plate, and added in the grandstand. Forbes Field seems like it was really cool. Here's a good shot of it (also with someone's drawing over it!). There's also a famous shot of kids watching the game from high above the park (pic #19 in this gallery).

This is a good aerial shot, to compare to the modern map. You can see all the trees that were out beyond center field, still there today. And that fountain, out beyond left-center. Home plate still exists, in a building, though its position is a little off to avoid it being in a bathroom.

(Note: On the map, where it says "Forbes Field," that's referring to the Little League field whose diamond you see. But it also says "Forbes Field" if you zoom in to where I show the old park being.)

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Layout/location of Crosley Field, Cincinnati. Keep in mind that I'm just using the little line drawing thing on Google Maps, which is why the "drawings" are so jut-jutty. I'm just giving a sense of where these parks were compared to how the streets look today.

Crosley Field was easy, all the work was done for me by whoever made this incredible site. He even talks about how you go about finding the location and mapping out the field.

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I've started finding locations of bygone fields and drawing them on the map. Above are the sites of Huntington Avenue Grounds (home of the Red Sox before Fenway), and below it and to the right, South End Grounds (home of the Braves before Braves Field).

You'll notice on the HAG, the very deep center field. 635 feet. There's also a Cy Young statue and and a home plate roughly where the mound and plate were, which I terribly have never been to. I guess I should explain the "drawings"--you should be able to make out the grandstand, and then the playing field for each.

I told you I saw "Braves Field" notated on Google Maps. Well, they've got Ebbets Field and Crosley Field on there, and those parks don't exist either. So I assume they have a lot more. As I draw more on the map I'm sure I'll find them.

Labels: old ballpark locations